Then there's an international chimpanzee park called Kibala Park where people come from around the world to study the chimps. There are also wetlands with interesting flora and fauna, birds and moths and well worth a visit, although you need to have strong legs to do a couple of hours walking there.

People can also go for a walk in the foothills of the mountains, or if they're really keen they could go and climb the things. We have people stay at the hotel, mountaineers, who stop with us on the way up there and stop on the way back. It's a very exciting area.

Jonathan: Now I notice for the adventurous there's also things like white water rafting, bungi jumping...

Colin: Yes that is the other side of Uganda and I can arrange that for people. The Nile rises in Lake Victoria in quite an amazing way. It comes bubbling up out of the bed of the lake and then it goes charging off down over the rocky slopes giving you the white water for rafting. Whilst the bungi jumping is off a cliff down over the water!

Jonathan: Now Colin what is interesting about what you have set up with Sunrise Safaris is that as well as it being a great place to have a holiday, for people who actually want to get involved with local people I understand that you have set up a number of different types of social activities to help the local people?

Colin: Yes. People have a pleasure in helping others, and we have a lot of availability in Uganda. For instance, I took a party of young people in their teens and twenties and my granddaughter was among them, and I said "love, I'll put you in a class teaching". And she said "granddad I can't do that, I'm not a teacher". I said "love you've got an education!", and so she and the others, they went teaching. Their first surprise was fifty kids to a class, the second was how well behaved they were and how eager they are to learn, because they have to pay to go to school and an education can help them get out of the poverty trap.

Now anybody of any experience would save many lives by their input with the people. But car mechanics, medical people, administrators, builders, anybody who's got a skill, trade or experience, I can try to help. I've got contacts with schools and hospitals but also with the motor trade, because I live there quite a bit. This would not be a very highly polished thing but it would be an interesting friendly involvement.

What is rather nice is to mix the two; come for a couple of weeks, have a holiday and help the local people. I can probably do that for a £1000 or under for the two weeks, fully inclusive except for the air flight, and give them perhaps a week/ten day holiday and a few days to help share their experience with others. So then they go home feeling doubly good! Now Jon what about you and Heather?

Jonathan: (Lots of laughter) I'm not sure it's right to ask me that in the middle of an interview! We'd love to come out one day Colin! Also I think it's interesting that there is a radio mast next door to your property; so who knows maybe one day there'll be a Cross Rhythms station out there!

Colin: I'd just like to say that if people would like to come, what a lovely way to serve God and put money into the third world by having a good holiday at the same time, and a bargain one at that.

Jonathan: Colin thank you and you're saying costs are around the £1000 mark. If people are interested to talk to you and try to arrange their own package, what's the web site address and how do they contact you?

Colin: The web site is www.sunrisesafaris.co.uk.